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rarespirits
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10206 posts [90%]
sOuL CaL
4-23-2006
 « Re: (Smitty_Works)« » Reply  Edit


delete it & pull the bulb, no need for it now, no turning back! HEHEHE J/K


I have a few question(s) of my own for you brake guys concerning the legend dual piston upgrade. Help me make sense of this, I hope I got it right. Thanks in advance! If I went wrong anywhere in there please correct me. I'm trying to grasp all this.

Legend Calipers - mill bracket

Prelude vtec rotors - redrill

Extended Ball Joints / aka RCAs -When using EBJs ball joints w/ new increased rotor size contact may occur w/ LCA ?

Katman rotor hat spacer - corrects rotor to LCA clearance w/ EBJs, will it push rotors to far forward and require the use of a hub centric ring?

Extended lug nut required - Is arp length a must? is there an oem supplement? I can't recall to the "T" if it was legend studs or?


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rarespirits
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10206 posts [90%]
sOuL CaL
4-23-2006
 « Re: (rarespirits)« » Reply  Edit


Quote, originally posted by rarespirits »
I have a few question(s) of my own for you brake guys concerning the legend dual piston upgrade. Help me make sense of this, I hope I got it right. Thanks in advance! If I went wrong anywhere in there please correct me. I'm trying to grasp all this.

Legend Calipers - mill bracket

Prelude vtec rotors - redrill

Extended Ball Joints / aka RCAs -When using EBJs ball joints w/ new increased rotor size contact may occur w/ LCA ?

Katman rotor hat spacer - corrects rotor to LCA clearance w/ EBJs, will it push rotors to far forward and require the use of a hub centric ring?

Extended lug nut required - Is arp length a must? is there an oem supplement? I can't recall to the "T" if it was legend studs or?

I don't know if anyone read my post and ?'s, but I want to say thank you guys for not replying! As much as I thought I read, or what reading I camouflaged by speed reading I was naive in posting this question. I woke up this morning determined to give a bit more effort on my end. Even though the topic is danced around in here multiple times, the answer lies in this thread folks. I've read all 120+ pages of this thread. This is a glorious thread if you like to read. If you do have brake questions that needs answering it is in here.

Funny how it all panned out, because as I was reading I was making notes and posting my questions to ask while I was reading. I did not want to forget, nor come off anymore confusing as I did ^^. I hope you guys don't mind links with "captions," now that I know the answer it feels as If I was having a discussion w/self...LOL I'll just post what I have found pertaining to the brake upgrade I was interested in. I've also broke it down in quotes to avoid clutter.

Quote, originally posted by My Q & A's and the source answer section »

http://forums.nwp4life.com/zer...age=3 & http://forums.nwp4life.com/zer...ge=98 and here http://forums.nwp4life.com/zer...e=123 covers/mentions oem longer stud from 3.2 CL

http://forums.nwp4life.com/zer...age=7 mentions of 2mm spacer behind the rotor to clear rim

http://forums.nwp4life.com/zer...ge=14
bottom of page the EBJ issue is mentioned

http://forums.nwp4life.com/zer...ge=15 EBJ topic is answered loosely but there is no mention of brake kit components. Car was stated to be an EL by sammy J, adj camber kit was mentioned as a possible cause of EBJ contacting rotors.

http://forums.nwp4life.com/zer...ge=24 jdmike as the only visual thus far with adj camber kit and EBJ http://farm5.static.flickr.com...b.jpg


http://forums.nwp4life.com/zer...ge=28 Corey threw out some spacer info here, backed by sammy, used by raul. But raul was using spoon calipers to my knowledge.

http://forums.nwp4life.com/zer...ge=43 Post by gourley: The optimal setup for lowering a car to make it perform and handle the way stock is as followed.
: New shocks and springs (Coilovers, 1 piece suspension, or spring and shock combo)
: Extended ball joints (Reduce bump steer and help re align all the suspension components)
: Camber kit, F&R (To set camber back to stock to A: Reduce tire wear and B: proper wheel/suspension alignment)
: Bushings. F&R Control arms Upper and Lower, Trailing arm are just the basics Unless car is new / or if bushings were recently replaced (If you are going to lower any older model Honda/Acura, chances are the bushings are shot and need replacement. Do it right and replace the main suspension bushings at least. You will pat your self on the back when you take it out for the first drive.)
: Alignment and Corner balance If necessary (Alignment is the most important aspect to lowering a car. If your wheels aren't aligned you car won't handle to its maximum performance and cause uneven tire wear. Corner balancing will only add to performance.)

http://forums.nwp4life.com/zer...ge=54 &

http://forums.nwp4life.com/zer...ge=95 ABC talks about legend calipers w/ 3mm spacer behind rotor. Still no solid answer for EBJ/rotor contact discussion

spacer purchase link http://forums.nwp4life.com/zerothread?id=19453

http://forums.nwp4life.com/zer...ge=82 Katman addressees one of my concerns, explains spacer vs bracket. this is the area I was confused about. Again there’s no mention to the dynamics when using EBJ/RCAs

"The formula is, you either use the hub spacers w/unshaved caliper brackets or run shaved caliper brackets and no hub spacer.

The point of the hub spacers is so you won't have to shave the caliper brackets at all and keep the brackets oem integrity.”

http://forums.nwp4life.com/zer...e=112 I believe this is the answer here. EGB & 1tuff Thank you guys!! So the spacers are to center rotor properly in the caliper, which is why the EBJ/RCAs touch in the first place?

so milling 3/3.2/3.5/3.7mm or whatever the spec is off the legend 2pot bracket does not provide this clearance?

last post of that page Katman only mentions this spacer to correct ITR/Prelude caliper….does this hold true for legend??

http://forums.nwp4life.com/zer...e=121 but here he answers it SCHWEEET!!

Off topic conglomerating this info. in a single post of reference.

http://forums.nwp4life.com/zer...e=116 another option to using redrilled prelude / mini rotors

Quote, originally posted by Here's what gay-guy stuff I had planned on purchasing prior to reading. »

Front:
Legend Calipers
Prelude Vtec rotors
Extended Ball Joints
Super Tie rod Arms
Milled Bracket/Spacer
arp studs
wheel bearings

Rear:
AP1/2 / ep3 / dc5 Calipers
Ep3 rotors
Wheel spacer
Arp Studs
wheel bearings

Quote, originally posted by Now after reading this will be my definitive purchase »

BUDGET LIST - Legend 2pot Calipers / Prelude vtec ( Vtak/vtek ) rotors / Extended Ball Joints

FRONT:
2 pot Legend Calipers w/ bracket
11" Prelude vtec ( h22) rotors redrilled 4x100
KM 3mm Rotor spacer
Extended Ball Joint
96-98 TL rears studs which is 2" long (90113-SD2-005)
Wheel Bearings

REAR:
S2000/RSX/EP3 Calipers with bracket
EP3 Rotors
96-98 TL rears studs which is 2" long (90113-SD2-005)
Wheel Bearings


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Katman
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4509 posts [100%]
Pasadizzle CA
5-5-2010
 « « » Reply  Edit


lol sorry for the late response
I'm finding I'm visiting NWP forum less lately, as are others.

glad you found your answers after some deep soul searching.

just to reiterate, yes you may run into contact issues when using extended LBJ's with a poorman's 11" rotor upgrade.

Being that the prelude vtec rotor's hat is deeper than say a GSR rotor's hat, the inner rotor face is placed closer to the lower ball joint's castle nut and will make contact with this nut in the event of using RCA's (aka extended lower ball joints). But with the use of a 3mm hub spacer, some space is given back, just enough so there is no contact. So in essence, the hub spacer is actually a dual purpose product.

1) corrects rotor offset (properly centers) within an ITR/legend/spoon twin block/NSX caliper's (so no caliper modding is necessary)
2) prevents rotor to castle nut contact when using roll center adjusters (extended ball joints).

However, if you go with mini cooper rotors you don't need a hub spacer and there shouldn't be any contact with the RCA's castle nut either being that the mini rotor's hat is not as deep as a prelude vtec/itr rotor's hat. The only thing I don't like about the mini rotors is that they're 22mm thick (ITR/prelude vtec are 23mm thick = can hang with more heat soak) and lug holes are too big and fit sloppy over honda wheel studs. But it doesn't seem to be a problem as Donut has been rocking & tracking on Mini rotors for a good while now. He's proof they work perfectly fine as a stand in for redrilled prelude vtec or ITR rotors.


Enjoying the iLife.

FF SQUAD | ©℆ valedictorian | JHPUSA | @RS | BECAUSE SGV | ESM | PITCREW | DOWNEYWERKS | RPM AUTO | RADIUM ENGINEERING

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rarespirits
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10206 posts [90%]
sOuL CaL
4-23-2006
 « « » Reply  Edit


Thanks for affirming.

My goods ordered starting to arrive. Reman nissin legend 2pot calipers w/ bracket

Used EP3 Calipers I will rebuild. One arrived w/ dust boot torn :(

4x100 3mm Hubcentric Spacer 56.1mm


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rarespirits
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10206 posts [90%]
sOuL CaL
4-23-2006
 « Re: (rarespirits)« » Reply  Edit


Ok some updates.... never use the word "definitive until it's said and done LOL....picked these up at a great price. Came out cheaper than OEM studs. So benefit and reduced cost, it made sense. I bought 16pcs ( 4pks ). I like extended studs all the way around, it's just a visual balance to me.

ARP wheel studs are point blank the best in fitment, length, and quality. I'm picky-ish, so I did some reading on length and tensile strength of extended wheel studs beforehand. ARP would win both those categories for me. Shortest and strongest; but you can never be too sure. Started the rears first.

GB VHT to prevent rust

Now since my main goal is to get this together and sort bugs in the future I grabbed some rotors locally and to support small businesses

Washed up and broke down the front knuckles/spindles


They made fun of me while I beat my dust shield back into shape ..lol

- old gsr discs/new prelude discs - yes the slots are for the visual allure

I cleaned a painted the old calipers, so if someone needs USED GSR stock calipers w/ pads lmk. They are fully functional. Old rotors are not available.


<br />

Modified by rarespirits at 7:55 AM 12/15/2014


1213 AFFILIATION -JDMKIDS | CALI LOVE | AS1 FAMILIA
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TECH15
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326 posts [100%]
BUSTOWN OH
5-16-2007
 « Re: (rarespirits)« » Reply  Edit


Loving the visual step by step rarespirits.
FUNCTION>fashion
BUILT NOT BOUGHT

Instagram: Tech15



rarespirits
NITE*GRIND Transmissions



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10206 posts [90%]
sOuL CaL
4-23-2006
 « Re: (TECH15)« » Reply  Edit


Quote, originally posted by TECH15 »
Loving the visual step by step rarespirits.

Thank you Tech, but I left out a few images Oooops! I'll continue the updates as I go.


Rear Trailing arms Before cleaning and disassembly.


after cleaning and disassembly to illustrate a lil paint goes a long way, some fresh coats of paint on my new old parts revive them quite nicely.





I was a can short of black to drizzle everything in gloss so I decided to give some wrinkle paint I had left a try on the rear splash shields. I like it so I may do the front as well.

dropped some paint on the front knuckles. The only reason I have not replaced the bearings on either front or rear is because they looked really good upon inspection. If it bites me later, I'll have to suck it up and redo. Gift & Curse.

buy new bolts they said...I said ehh ehh!

the aftermath and assembly, just got one more bushing to press in. I'll get better pics as well these were taken late in the day low light/indoor






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rarespirits
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10206 posts [90%]
sOuL CaL
4-23-2006
 « « » Reply  Edit


I have a question I hope one of you can answer regarding ABS on 94-97 & 98-01 integras. Has anyone put the smaller modulator from the 98-01 in 94-97?

I am aware the plugs are different and the function is different, and hope this can be overcome by the ECU. As I understand it 98-01 controls both front and rear independently. A true 4way system. The 94-97 controls front independently but the rears together.

Now wired correctly, using a 98-01 modulator and plug, and 94-97 abs computer can I "trick" this to function like the modulator from 94-97?


1213 AFFILIATION -JDMKIDS | CALI LOVE | AS1 FAMILIA
1213 AFFINITY - NITE GRIND TRANSMISSIONS | GRIPSET | NASTIE GARAGE | CALI LOVE CLOTH. | My Classifieds


rarespirits
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10206 posts [90%]
sOuL CaL
4-23-2006
 « Re: (rarespirits)« » Reply  Edit


No worries about that ^ got it all sorted. Accords, S2000s, Preludes all have 3 channel and 4 channels abs systems so if you are looking for a smaller ABS module for your 3 channel any of those car will work as long as you get the appropriate connector ( hard part ). ITR and Prelude share the same modulator. As for me and my fix, I ended up getting all my compadres leftovers from his dc that went K. I wasn't going to cheap the homie but it was all scrap to him anyway, so I offered and gave him $100 for the Modulator, abs harness, abs ecu, and 4 sensors.

Now where I went wrong was in decision/planning. I was planning on building an EK HB, but ended up buying a bg33 integra. ABS was factory on these cars and that key fact totally slipped through my blueprints. Upon removal and sale of the disc brake conversion I realized the rear discs I was building were not abs compatible. Stuck in a hard spot, I contacted the buyer to verify he did not need the ABS before I swapped over the parts. Luckily he didn't and I dodged a bullet this time. Why does anyone want ABS anyway I have my reasons.

Onto the next phase. To convert non abs rear hubs to abs you can simply swap over the rear hubs, unless you dolled them all up like I did and welded in your extended studs.....Ugggh Poorly planned again. I felt so retarded for that one.

To convert to abs if you do not wish to loose welded in extended studs you will need to get to work, and acquire the following:

Rear ABS dust shield
Rear ABS Hub ring
Machine shop
4CH Rear abs sensors - 98+ Integra = prelude/accord/ AP2 same ( don't recall anyone confirming the interchangeability of 3CH sensors using 4CH modulator )
Aerosol of choice to suit if you've painted your parts.

ABS provision rear hub

Hub & Ring

Ring bored out to fit ( so machine rings to the smallest ID, as it is pressed on it will fit tighter on the hub at it's largest OD )

Snug fit Hub Tapers

So this was a completed pic until I encountered the ABS ordeal LOL


1213 AFFILIATION -JDMKIDS | CALI LOVE | AS1 FAMILIA
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rarespirits
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10206 posts [90%]
sOuL CaL
4-23-2006
 « « » Reply  Edit


Just want to say thanks Katman!!! Got my hat spacers corrected last week. If there's still a demand the machinist will be able to do a run at $24 a pair. Those will be similar to these minus 4 extra holes.


1213 AFFILIATION -JDMKIDS | CALI LOVE | AS1 FAMILIA
1213 AFFINITY - NITE GRIND TRANSMISSIONS | GRIPSET | NASTIE GARAGE | CALI LOVE CLOTH. | My Classifieds


Katman
FF Technical TheRapist



Offline

4509 posts [100%]
Pasadizzle CA
5-5-2010
 « Re: (rarespirits)« » Reply  Edit


nice updates!


Enjoying the iLife.

FF SQUAD | ©℆ valedictorian | JHPUSA | @RS | BECAUSE SGV | ESM | PITCREW | DOWNEYWERKS | RPM AUTO | RADIUM ENGINEERING

R.I.P.: Juan Lemus / Colt Burns / Adam West / MCA


rev210k
Member



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174 posts [100%]
6-21-2010
 « Re: (Katman)« » Reply  Edit


I've searched all around but didn't get a complete answer. Can anyone confirm that spoon monoblocks work with 99 RL rotors? I know the rotor fits over my type r hub but I need to know if the caliper will slide over the rotor with pads in it or do I have to shave the pads down.



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